Tool Talk
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Bill Houghton on July 03, 2014, 04:27:42 PM
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When Dad was adding to our house – the addition he put on, starting when I was five, roughly doubled the size of the house – the measuring choice for room-sized carpentry was pretty much between a small, short tape measure and a six foot zig zag rule. The modern tape measures large enough to choke an elephant were way far in the future.
I think Dad’s tape measure, and the hours I spent holding one end of it as he worked on the house, is most of why I got started picking up old tape measures at yard/estate sales. I don’t have many; at least, I don’t consider 17 very many. But they’re interesting things. Here’s my herd. I won’t talk about each one; just the highlights.
I’m starting, of course, with Dad’s tape measure, which I inherited when we broke up our parents’ house. It’s nothing fancy – a simple little push/pull six footer from Evans. That, and his no-name 30” wooden level, were his main layout tools, once the foundation and framing were in place (I suspect my grandfather, who helped with the foundation and framing, had larger carpentry layout tools; but I was five, and not paying close enough attention).
I’m showing my round and half-round tape measures next, because, as I understand it, the original portable steel tape measure was a loose springy measure that rolled up into a can resembling a chewing tobacco tin. These are kind of the next logical step, keeping the shape while adding a spring. The top tapes all have a plain steel finish on the tape itself that signals age (it took a while for manufacturers to realize that a painted finish was easier to read and more rust-resistant – or it may have taken a while for a sufficiently durable, flexible paint to come out of the paint labs). The top left “Little Pal” is just three feet long; top center is a promotional piece from the Northern California Hardware and Steel Company in San Francisco; and top right has a ratcheting lock, released by the center button, a great idea about which the manufacturer was rather modest, since there’s no maker’s name on it.
The bottom two tapes signal the beginning of the move toward blockier tape measures. Both of them have the familiar notation on the bottom indicating how much distance to add for the case when making inside measurements.
The third picture has some locking tapes. This was a pretty important advance for people working alone – appreciated by anyone who’s tried to catch an edge with the tape from a distance, or had a non-locking tape suddenly roll up because an errant breeze knocked the hook loose. The top left (now nameless, although I think there was originally a “badge” on the other side of the tape) has a slide activated by the red button and released by another button on the other side; the design is superior to Stanley’s Leverlock design, now an industry standard, because the tape has no tendency to slip when being locked. The other three automatically lock when extended, rolling back when the center button is pushed (much like many vacuum cleaners retract their cords); the Lufkin has the added feature of a locking lever.
Picture four shows some tapes made by H K Porter, a conglomerate that gobbled up all kinds of companies in the 50s. Three of the four – the top two “Chiefs” from Carlson & Sullivan (established in the early 50s to make tape measures, bought by Porter in 1955 and later folded into Disston) and the Disston bottom left – represent product names owned by Porter. The bottom right tape is one of my favorite ever “gimme” promotional items. I’m not sure why the Zoom cereal people (still in production, now part of Krusteaz/Continental Mills) thought a tape measure would increase the consumption of their cereal, but they did, and turned to H K Porter for help.
Finally, every organizational scheme needs room for “miscellaneous,” and that’s what we’ve got here. I don’t know who made the top left tape, but I do know I like the Art Deco styling. I couldn’t resist the top center tape when I found it at a yard sale, because the shape is such a nice pun on the advertising slogan. The tape autolocks as it’s pulled out; the black button on the chimney (from which the tape issues) retracts it. This is my only fractional/metric tape. The top right tape is another promotional piece, this one from CT Engineering Corporation, which apparently provided contract personnel (temps, in other words) in Houston and southern California; the firm appears still to be in service, with a different focus. I couldn’t do an essay on tapes without the ubiquitous Stanley Leverlock/Powerlock, so here’s one in the bottom left. Finally, we have two little Lufkins from different eras, designed to drop in your pocket. The red plastic one, bottom right, came as a freebie with the 25-foot Lufkin that lives in my toolbelt. Lufkin’s slide lock is better than Stanley’s; like the button lock described up above, it doesn’t move the tape when activated.
These aren’t all my tape measures. I realized after taking the photos for this post that I’d forgotten the tape in my car’s glovebox (there for yard sales, in case I have to measure something), and I didn’t bother to show the 25 foot tapes that we’re all familiar with. I also have a couple of long tapes, a nice old leather-covered 50 footer from my uncle and the plastic-bodied Stanley 100-footer that I actually use on the job because I don’t care as much about getting it dirty. And I have three folding (zig-zag) rules with slide extensions on one end, way better than tapes for inside measures; and a fourth all-metal zig-zag that unfolds to six feet, handy when I need a little more precision than the tapes offer.
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Nicely done
hope it stirs up some more show-n-tell.
Skip
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I enjoyed your presentation, very well done and very interesting,
thank you, Frank
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In 1982 when I became indentured as a sprinklerfitter apprentice they had to give you certain tools (we could not use personal tools.) They hsd to give us a 6 ft folding rule, but not a tape measure. My company gave us 25 ft Stanley tapes anyway.
Now my most often used measuring tool is a Hilti laser type, along with a 6 ft folding ruler. I buy one kind of hilti laser for some of our fitters and engineers and a different one for myself. Theirs cost ~$200.00, and mine cost $700.00. I learned that kind of trick while an apprentice also. If I needed a new 9" level I told my fitter. About half of them gave me the new level. The other half gave me their used level and they got the new level.
Chilly
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A lot of those look familiar Bill, my Dad had a round one like those pictured but it also had a red button in the middle to lock. It was all steel, no plastic back then.
I scored a job while still in school and worked Saturday mornings in a small engineering shop, they had me cutting out sheet metal on a guillotine as my first job. Within the first hour I had successfully cut the end off Dads tape he had owned for years. He was less than impressed with me, and never really happy with the flash new replacement I bought him.
Batz
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Nice collection of tapes Bill! Your second photo really brings back some memories. I'm pretty sure the one in the lower left corner is the same one my dad had when I was a kid. Tape measures were still a bit rare around here back then, and there was no money for a new one. Hence, I never got to play with it as a lad. Not sure what ever became of it.
What brand is it if I may ask? (lower left)
(http://www.papawswrench.com/vboard/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=11775.0;attach=31959;image)
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What brand is it if I may ask? (lower left)
Pretty sure it's a Lufkin...
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The top left (now nameless, although I think there was originally a “badge” on the other side of the tape) has a slide activated by the red button and released by another button on the other side...
And I'm pretty sure this is an Evans...
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Nice collection of tapes Bill! Your second photo really brings back some memories. I'm pretty sure the one in the lower left corner is the same one my dad had when I was a kid. Tape measures were still a bit rare around here back then, and there was no money for a new one. Hence, I never got to play with it as a lad. Not sure what ever became of it.
What brand is it if I may ask? (lower left)
(http://www.papawswrench.com/vboard/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=11775.0;attach=31959;image)
I'm sorry to say, Plyerman, that the brand name has disappeared from the tape. I think it was probably on the center button originally, but is worn off now.
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Bill, very nice you have your dads tape !!
Here are a couple I have picked up.
Brian
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Heres 4 that were handy to find. The one may be an Evans but is too worn to tell. The Barlow was evidently a handout from a home interior company. Have a few more around but inertia has me.
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I have a barlow and some others that have 1/8" & 1/4" scale rulers instead of inches or centimeters. Better go dig for pictures.....
Chilly
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Chilly... I have my 1/8 and 1/4 " graduated tape measure. We used them "back in the day" when working on grid scale industrial plant layout boards. The standard scale was 1/4 ' = 1 foot. The tape was real handy when doing scale layouts that might be hundreds of feet long. "Back in the day" ... that's up till all that kinda' thing was taken over by the computer.
Joe B
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I keep finding these interesting little tape measures. Today's score: a 50 foot Disston tape (Disston/Carlson), and an Atlantic.
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These are a couple of leather bound Lufkin Rule Co. steel tape measures I found over the years. The 100-foot tape on the left was branded "Challenge" , and the 50-foot one on the right."Reliable". The "Reliable" tape was patented May 23, 1893 and December 17, 1907 according to embossed information on its leather cover. My Dad was a civil engineer, and had a similar 100-foot tape, made by K & E, when I was a boy. I took a civil engineering course as an undergraduate, and we used 100-foot tapes in field work. So my guess is that such tapes were marketed to, and used by, civil engineers, among others, during the late 19th, and through much of the 20th, centuries.
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My latest find, from a commercial estate sale firm that charges sane prices. This one's interesting for two reasons:
1. At some point prior to the reorganization that led to a new name, in 1973, there was money in the budget for custom-ordered tapes.
2. The tape is marked in 16ths on one edge and 100ths of a foot on the other, I assume for checking plans.
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cloth tape
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cloth tape
That's pretty nifty. You can measure the fish you caught, to see if it'll fit in the fridge, and the cloth tape ensures it won't rust; just don't let anyone see the measurement, so that you can continue to lie about how large a fish you caught.
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Bill that is strange, I googled NWYS and it comes up Northwest youth service ???
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Bill that is strange, I googled NWYS and it comes up Northwest youth service ???
The picture's a touch out of focus. If I'd done a better job on the picture, you'd see it reads, "California Div. of Hwys," as in "highways." This was the name for the roads crew folks for many years, a department/division that moved around quite a bit as government got reorganized.
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Bill, I'm pretty sure I have one just like your dad's but branded Firestone.
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thank's Bill.
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cloth tape
For Mama when she makes shirts and dresses for herself and the young' uns.
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I need to post some pictures of some of mine. I just did a quick count, and I am up to 525. Nowhere near my zig zag collection (around 800), but it is getting close. I have a couple that are used to set dynamite charges that are interesting. I also like the figural ones, like golfball and seashell shapes. I have a bunch of new in the box refills, which I probably should not have counted separately.
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I have a bunch of new in the box refills, which I probably should not have counted separately.
Your tape measures. You're allowed to count them any way you want.
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...I am up to 525. Nowhere near my zig zag collection (around 800)...
OK, I fold. I don't even have that kind of shop/storage space, much less the time to gather that many!
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I need to post some pictures of some of mine. I just did a quick count, and I am up to 525. Nowhere near my zig zag collection (around 800), but it is getting close. I have a couple that are used to set dynamite charges that are interesting. I also like the figural ones, like golfball and seashell shapes. I have a bunch of new in the box refills, which I probably should not have counted separately.
For the record I would love to see some pictures of your collections.
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I need to post some pictures of some of mine. I just did a quick count, and I am up to 525. Nowhere near my zig zag collection (around 800), but it is getting close. I have a couple that are used to set dynamite charges that are interesting. I also like the figural ones, like golfball and seashell shapes. I have a bunch of new in the box refills, which I probably should not have counted separately.
For the record I would love to see some pictures of your collections.
Same here!
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...I am up to 525. Nowhere near my zig zag collection (around 800)...
OK, I fold. I don't even have that kind of shop/storage space, much less the time to gather that many!
I have been collecting them for 26 years. I also have bought large volumes of tools for my Ebay business, and I can cull out all the tape measures and zig zags that I do not have. You would be surprised how little space it takes up. I have some 12 drawer microfiche cabinets that most of the thinner and smaller ones can fit in. I will take some photos of my cabinets when I upload some photos of my collection to this thread.
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Bill,
If it makes you feel any better, I am jealous of your highway department Lufkin one. Odd Lufkins are some of my favorites. Have you seen the Donut ones? They always go high on Ebay. I finally bit the bullet and bought one a few years ago.
John
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525? Pictures or it didn't happen (please!). :cheesy:
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"never challenge a mans word without proof that he is wrong."
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I am having problems. I will try to post some photos.
John
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Craftsman and Barlow Tapes.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Disston Tapes.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Evans Tapes.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/K&E Tapes.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Master Tapes.JPG)
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(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Lufkin Tapes 1.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Lufkin Tapes 2.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Lufkin Tapes 3.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Lufkin Tapes 4.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Lufkin Tapes 5.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Lufkin Tapes 6.JPG)
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(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Correct rules.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Lufkin Donut Tape.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Refills 1.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tape Cabinet.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tape Cabinet 2.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tapes 1.JPG)
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(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tapes 2.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tapes 3.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tapes 4.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tapes 5.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tapes 6.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tapes 7.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tapes 8.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tapes 9.JPG)
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I have 18 more photos but I better check with Papaw first. I do not want to post too many. I am html linking to my website, so it may not matter.
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Lots of nice tapes there - the name "Lufkin" sure jumps out at me. I've become right fond of Lufkin, out there in Saginaw, making all kinds of good tools a third of the way across the country from the industrial centers in New England where most of the toolmakers were.
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Yes, I really like Lufkin. My first rule was an 873L advertising with protractor and level. They started in Cleveland and moved to Saginaw in 1892. I only have a few Cleveland Lufkin items. I even have a Saginaw Michigan street brick I got at a flea market.
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(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tapes 10.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tapes 11.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tapes 12.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tapes 13.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tapes 14.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tapes 15.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tapes 16.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tapes 17.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tapes 18.JPG)
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Wow, what a great collection! I see more room in some of those drawers. Definitely requires more work. :grin:
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Last set of the tapes. I also have tons of zig zags and misc rules.
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tapes 20.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tapes 21.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tapes 22.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tapes 23.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tapes 24.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tapes 25.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tapes 26.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tapes 27.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/Tapes 28.JPG)
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The top right of the 3rd one down in my last post shows those demolition charge setting tapes. Other favorites are the Master Ladies Man tapes, Lufkin Pee Wee, Lufkin GroTape, Lawn Tennis Measure, 3 Farrand Rapid Rule NOS tapes with mailing bag (pre Stanley) (the original coiled steel tape), and one of the cloth tapes that measures a cows girth and tells you how much it weighs.
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Sorry Bill; I did not mean to hijack your thread, but I had to respond to the challenge to show them!
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I'm a sucker for two and four fold's.
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Nice collection, glad to see somebody else get crazy about a specific area of tool collecting.
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I'm a sucker for two and four fold's.
I don't have as many of those. I like the two fold metal ones and the odd four fold ones like the ones with the level in them. I took photos of my 800+ zig zags yesterday. I will have to make a thread for them sometime. I have a lot of same model type variants of those, particularly the Lufkin ones.
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very impressive collection, and those drawers are just the right size to store/display that type of tools.
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Sorry Bill; I did not mean to hijack your thread, but I had to respond to the challenge to show them!
Not a hijack if it's on topic - and even wandering off topic is fine with me, as long as we're all having fun!
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Thank you both for the pictures. Amazing. :cry:
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I just looked at the 6 foot tape measure I picked up a few weeks back. It is a Lufkin. On the reverse side of the tape it says "Cocktail Tape" and recipe after recipe for cocktails.
Here's one from Etsy.
https://www.etsy.com/listing/201470628/vintage-tape-measure-cocktail-tape-dad
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That is a cool tape. I will have to try to pick one up sometime. There was a sold one on Ebay for 12.00.
I have 4 or 5 tape repair kits. They are pretty hard to find; especially the fancy Lufkin ones.
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/tape repair.JPG)
Here are some more photos of my other display/storage cabinets:
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/cabinet1.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/cabinet2.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/cabinet3.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/cabinet4.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/cabinet5.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/cabinet6.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/cabinet7.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/cabinet8.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/cabinet9.JPG)
(http://www.wvtools.com/images/tooltalk/cabinet10.JPG)
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Very nice vintage storage you have there.
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Very nice vintage storage you have there.
Some of them I got pretty cheap, but several I had to pay quite a bit for at Donnelly's July auctions. My room is getting really crowded. I have one room up in the attic about 10 x 15. You will see when I post pics of my tool book collection. Most of those shelves are in them middle of the room.
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John- I sent you a message and an email about an Invento tape measure made in France.
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Maybe wvtools has a new email address, I don't get any response from him here or by email.
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Papaw,
I sent you a reply, but I must have messed something up. Thanks for thinking of me. I think I have that one, but I will have to check. I will be out of town for awhile. I have to get ready this weekend to go to the longest yard sale in TN next week to sell, and then I will be out of town for work for several days when I get back. When I get back, I will post pics of the many zig zags and tape measures I got at the Donnelly sale last weekend.
Thanks,
John
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They keep showing up; I picked up a "Walsco" measure today.
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And they keep showing up some more. Here's a Lufkin "Pee Wee" tape - 6 foot capacity, but 1/4" width.
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And more...
The Lufkin engineer's tape, to the right, is another with fractional measures on one edge (32nds for the first foot, 16ths after) and 10ths and 100ths of a foot on the other. Presumably for civil engineers.
(http://www.papawswrench.com/vboard/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=11775.0;attach=47823;image)
The K&E "LST [level-square-tape]" is an odd duck. K&E, or Keuffel and Esser, was a respected maker of drafting and surveying equipment (including slide rules) in New Jersey and New York. This tape seems to have been a rather desperate attempt to be hip and relevant, probably in the 1960s or 70s. It's a ten foot tape, nothing fancy there. Four little nubbins on the case, two on the bottom and two on the vertical side, test to a pretty accurate square; but there are limited uses for testing inside square on a very short baseline. The nubbins, though, allow the level bubble on top of the case to test both level and plumb, but, again, on a very short baseline.
(http://www.papawswrench.com/vboard/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=11775.0;attach=47825;image)