Tool Talk

Wrench Forum => Wrench Forum => Topic started by: leg17 on September 03, 2011, 07:43:01 PM

Title: Champion "S" Wrench
Post by: leg17 on September 03, 2011, 07:43:01 PM: I have a couple of pretty generic looking "S" wrenches marked CHAMPION.
Anyone know who made them?
They are not marked 'DEARMENT', just CHAMPION.
Maybe the Blower and Forge Champion?
Or maybe Gene Autrey's horse?
Title: Re: Champion "S" Wrench
Post by: keykeeper on September 03, 2011, 09:34:59 PM: A picture would help. What sizes are they?

I have seen wrenches before marked "Champion", but only online.

I believe Champion Blower and Forge did ship wrenches with some of their items. I know I have seen one that goes with a post drill made by them in an eBay auction some time back. It was made to fit the square head set screws to tighten the "Never Slip" drill chuck, and the screws that secured the crank handles, flywheels and table adjustment clamp.

I'd be interested in trading for them if, after seeing them, they are for that purpose. I have two of there post drills, and a forge blower.
Title: Re: Champion "S" Wrench
Post by: rusty on September 03, 2011, 11:10:18 PM: I have a whole set of 5 or 6 , sequentially numbered, somewhere. I don't think they are for Champion Blower&Forge co, a whole set wouldn't make any sense. I decided at one point that they might possibly be related to Syracuse Wrench co, but mostly just because they were using that name on socket sets, never found any conclusive proof of it...
Title: Re: Champion "S" Wrench
Post by: jimwrench on September 04, 2011, 04:24:00 PM: Need a picture. Some possibilities are "Champion Corp of Hammond,In and Champion Mower and Reaper Co. of Springfield,Il" Both of these companies produced "S' wrenchs. I have some wrenchs marked "Champion " that I don't believe were made by either of these companies.
Title: Re: Champion "S" Wrench
Post by: leg17 on September 04, 2011, 05:08:52 PM: Haven't got photo resources at the moment.
The wrenches have CHAMPION and a blank number 503 or 504 forged into the handle. These were stamped into the die, not stamped into the wrench, so they are raised up on the wrench.
The heads have no markings, not even size.

There is a couple on eBay right now that look like they match. This looks like them.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Champion-500-Curved-S-Vintage-Wrench-6-Ll-1-2-X-3-8-/370487896429?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item5642cca96d
Title: Re: Champion "S" Wrench
Post by: Bus on October 26, 2011, 10:09:59 PM: Here are the Champion wrenches I have. S-wrenches top to bottom are marked: 500, 501, 502, 503, 504 and 504A.
Straight wrenches with angled ends on right don't have a number. Length top to bottom is: 9", 8-1/4" (Notice that this is the only one whith with openings for hex nuts or bolts), 7", 5-3/4" and 4-1/2".

Would like to find out who made these for sure and if anybody has any I don't have. I have several duplicates to trade.

(http://i222.photobucket.com/albums/dd3/buswrench/message-board/champion-wrenches.jpg)
Title: Re: Champion "S" Wrench
Post by: Wrenchmensch on October 29, 2011, 11:24:37 AM: Bus:

The Champion wrenches on the right side of your photograph are what are called 'Textile' wrenches in the Delaware Valley. I am not sure why. Do you know why, and is it possible the Champion wrenches you display were made for two different end uses?
Title: Re: Champion "S" Wrench
Post by: leg17 on October 29, 2011, 12:54:46 PM: BUMP

Still wondering who made them.

The "textile" pattern is at least back to the turn of the century, (the OTHER turn).
I think they are in early Williams catalogs.
Other than the obvious, I don't know the specific intended use.
Title: Re: Champion "S" Wrench
Post by: Wrenchmensch on October 29, 2011, 01:45:50 PM: Jim:

You know more about companies named "Champion" than I do. I have a partially-identified 10-inch Champion (it's similar to a Whitely wrench) in my collection. Do you know if this wrench was produced by the Champion Mower and Reaper Company? It does have the "cold fingers" style of adjustment knob favored by the end users of agricultural wrenches in winter.

Bob
Title: Re: Champion "S" Wrench
Post by: skipskip on February 15, 2014, 08:51:38 PM: I found three of the straight wrenches with angled ends today.

did we ever find out any more about this company??

Skip
Title: Re: Champion "S" Wrench
Post by: HeelSpur on March 24, 2014, 05:53:31 PM: I put a few rusted wrenches in vinegar yesterday and gave them a quick brushes to see if there were any markings and 2 of them are Champion s wrenches. Haven't seen any numbers they're pretty crusty yet.
Title: Re: Champion "S" Wrench
Post by: Twertsy on March 07, 2016, 05:42:20 AM: Last week while doing research on Cornwell (you guys should check it out under Todd's Research on my site.........their "corporate history" is complete BS!) and looking for more information on the company Eugene Cornwell LEFT Cornwell to form, Titan-Rite of Elmira, NY. Anyway, I came across an advertisement for these Champion Wrenches by Syracuse Wrench Co.
Title: Re: Champion "S" Wrench
Post by: leg17 on March 07, 2016, 09:17:59 AM: Can you add a reference or a link?
Thanks
Title: Re: Champion "S" Wrench
Post by: Twertsy on March 07, 2016, 09:19:33 AM: Quote from: leg17 on March 07, 2016, 09:17:59 AM
Can you add a reference or a link?
Thanks

https://books.google.com/books?id=7B5aAAAAYAAJ&pg=RA6-PA54&dq=%22Champion+Wrench%22&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiOj4jc767LAhXDHT4KHUp2DZ4Q6AEIOTAB#v=onepage&q=%22Champion%20Wrench%22&f=false
Title: Re: Champion "S" Wrench
Post by: leg17 on March 07, 2016, 10:30:59 AM: Thanks a lot.
Could be a possibility though 'S' wrenches not shown.
Title: Re: Champion "S" Wrench
Post by: Twertsy on March 07, 2016, 05:48:41 PM: Quote from: leg17 on March 07, 2016, 10:30:59 AM
Thanks a lot.
Could be a possibility though 'S' wrenches not shown.

Yeah, I couldn't relocate the one I saw last week. I'll try again in the morning.
Title: Re: Champion "S" Wrench
Post by: turnnut on March 07, 2016, 08:56:35 PM: the term "textile" sounds like they were also used to adjust the looms in the textile factory.
Title: Re: Champion "S" Wrench
Post by: Mister Ed on March 20, 2021, 06:39:55 PM: Quote from: Twertsy on March 07, 2016, 05:42:20 AM
Last week while doing research on Cornwell (you guys should check it out under Todd's Research on my site.........their "corporate history" is complete BS!) and looking for more information on the company Eugene Cornwell LEFT Cornwell to form, Titan-Rite of Elmira, NY. Anyway, I came across an advertisement for these Champion Wrenches by Syracuse Wrench Co.

OK . . . all of this was posted a long time a go, but there was never a definitive answer. Who made those CHAMPION branded curved wrenches? And here's mine . . .
Title: Re: Champion "S" Wrench
Post by: four.cycle on March 21, 2021, 10:02:05 PM: this is all I have at the moment on "Champion". I haven't gone down this rabbit hole enough times yet, apparently.

Champion / (see Girard) /

Champion / (see Greene Tweed & Co.) (see patent 442569) /

Champion / (see Ithaca Drop Forge Co.)(Bufford Chain Wrench patent 442569) /

Champion / (see Keystone Forge) /

Champion / (see Losee) / patent 864659 /

Champion / (manufactured by New Britain Machine) /

Champion / (see Syracuse Wrench Co.) /

Champion / (see Union Hardware Co.) / (screwdriver) /

Champion / Champion-Arrowhead, 5147 Alhambra Ave., Los Angeles, CA 90032 / sprinkler and irrigation wrenches /

Champion / Champion Blower & Forge Co., Lancaster, PA / taps, dies, screw plates / "Electric" screw plates /

Champion / (Champion Brass see Champion Arrowhead) /

Champion / Champion DeArment / Champion DeArment Co., Meadville, PA / (see also Channellock) / http://alloy-artifacts.org/champion-dearment-tool.html / http://alloy-artifacts.org/champion-dearment-tool.html#history / http://toolarchives.com/index.php/node/96 /

Champion / Champion Mower & Reaper, Springfield, IL /

Champion / Champion Potato Co., Hammond, IN / "OK Champion" /

Champion / Champion Silo Co., Des Moines, IA /

Champion / Champion Tool Co., Meadville, PA /

Champion / Champion Wrench Co., Chicago, IL / patent 1371952 /

Champion * / (see also notes below re: Champion ) /

re: Champion (notes by twertsy)

A. G. Coes & Co. Worchester, MA (Made for Champion Mower & Reaper Co.)
L. Coes & Co. Worchester, MA (Made for Champion Mower & Reaper Co.)
J. Asbury (Birmingham, England) patented 12/22/1869: (GB patent: GB-186903709) http://www.datamp.org/patents/advance.php?pn=186903709&id=53001&set=3
Champion Mower & Reaper Co. (Springfield, IL) // Also made by Whitely, Fassler and Kelly prior to forming the former company
W & B Co. Marked "Champion W&B Co. Pat FEBY 23, 83" (?)
Champion Mfg. Co.
William M. Whitely Co. // Whitely Reaper Works Springfield, OH (wrench for adjusting reapers, marked CHAMPION) (Eventually were consumed by IHC)

==

RE: "textile wrenches"

They were "textile wrenches" because they were used in the textile mills of New England. The looms and other machines in the mills used square nuts, and the 22½° offset on each end apparently lent itself well to their use on the square nuts used on the machinery. The Williams Company made many of them stamped with the names of the textile (or other) mills in which they were used.
Title: Re: Champion "S" Wrench
Post by: four.cycle on March 21, 2021, 10:10:42 PM: re: "textile wrench"

also made by Billings:
Title: Re: Champion "S" Wrench
Post by: Mister Ed on March 22, 2021, 10:38:37 AM: Thank you four.cycle for your "hole" effort. I am as diligent and "rabbit" a tool researcher, but my own effort convinces me that the S-curve Champions originated with Syracuse Wrench. I'll scurry back to my hutch now.
Title: Re: Champion "S" Wrench
Post by: leg17 on March 22, 2021, 12:59:21 PM: Quote from: Mister Ed on March 22, 2021, 10:38:37 AM
Thank you four.cycle for your "hole" effort. I am as diligent and "rabbit" a tool researcher, but my own effort convinces me that the S-curve Champions originated with Syracuse Wrench. I'll scurry back to my hutch now.

What did you find that identified them as Syracuse?
Title: Re: Champion "S" Wrench
Post by: d42jeep on March 22, 2021, 03:44:48 PM: Quote from: four.cycle on March 21, 2021, 10:10:42 PM
re: "textile wrench"

also made by Billings:
Here you go, BK. It took me a while to find. I had conversations with Todd about this wrench a few years ago and we agreed that we didn’t actually know much about it. There was just no conclusive evidence that we could find.
-Don
Title: Re: Champion "S" Wrench
Post by: amecks on March 22, 2021, 08:43:15 PM: I stumbled across an article which briefly mentions Champion wrenches. " Collecting Antique Wrenches A Welcome Diversion
Collector Don Lux likes challenge of collecting antique wrenches" on Farm Collector website.
https://www.farmcollector.com/tools/a-welcome-diversion-collector-likes-challenge-of-wrenches (https://www.farmcollector.com/tools/a-welcome-diversion-collector-likes-challenge-of-wrenches)
Here is the relevant part of the article..."He likes his Champion wrenches, too. "Champion was bought by IH. The two I have have 's' curves in them. The reason they made those with the 's' curve is, if you put that on the nut right and the nut broke off quick, your fingers wouldn't get smashed. The knuckles wouldn't get bruised. They were hidden by that 's' curve, and it protected your hand." ".
Not sure of the veracity of this collector's knowledge. There is a comment about Ferguson plow wrenches having numbers on them so you could stick it in the gas tank to measure the fuel level. Well, yes, everyone stuck them in the tank (old Fords had the same wrench) but the measurements were there to measure plow depth. My authority comes from 14 years as a Ford tractor mechanic. He is wrong but its an understandable error.
Al
Title: Re: Champion "S" Wrench
Post by: four.cycle on March 27, 2021, 08:24:25 AM: d42jeep -

really?

you're just messin' with me now, right?

I still have a whole list of stuff to pick through yet, but I posted the updated list at GJ because I needed to get that out of the way.

I'll revisit "Champion" when I have turned over every other rock on the beach.
Title: Re: Champion "S" Wrench
Post by: d42jeep on March 27, 2021, 12:13:15 PM: Quote from: four.cycle on March 27, 2021, 08:24:25 AM
d42jeep -

really?

you're just messin' with me now, right?

I still have a whole list of stuff to pick through yet, but I posted the updated list at GJ because I needed to get that out of the way.

I'll revisit "Champion" when I have turned over every other rock on the beach.
I know you like a challenge.
-Don